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[Táctica] o 4-4-2 e a "dimensão europeia"
14-05-2009, 22:00 (Esta mensagem foi modificada pela última vez a: 14-05-2009 22:31 por Nagato.)
Mensagem: #1
[Táctica] o 4-4-2 e a "dimensão europeia"
Muito se fala das diferenças entre o jogar com 3 ou 4 médios, principalmente a nível da liga dos campeões e a importância de um 4º médio que faz com que o meio-campo torne-se mais consistente variando entre o 4-4-2 clássico com dois médios ala (atenção que médio ala é diferente de extremo para quem não souber) ou mesmo o 4-4-2 losango que permite aos médios interiores fazerem o jogo a partir do meio flectindo para as alas. Obviamente que o principal é ter bons jogadores porque se os jogadores não forem nada de especial, a táctica pode ser muito boa mas não funciona.


Estou a falar destas diferenças nomeadamente de um problema especifico, do FCPorto e do seu 4-3-3 a nivel europeu que em anos anteriores tornou o Porto vulnerável contra equipas de topo. O que mudou este ano para o Porto fazer exibições mais consistentes na Champions e ir mais longe? Simples, a introdução de um jogador Christian Rodriguez. Este jogador na Champions fez com que o Porto em 80% dos jogos passa-se a jogar em 4-4-2 tornando-se o 4º médio necessário contra equipas com grande cultura táctica, passando o Hulk a ser um elemento mais solto no terreno variando mais no flanco esquerdo devido ao facto do Rodriguez manter-se numa posição central, tendo também o um jogador importante o Chissokho que subia muito no terreno permitindo ao Rodriguez jogar em posições mais centrais e com isso a equipa fez grandes exibições contra o Atlético e o Manchester.
Claro que há sempre um contra exemplo importante em relação à maior consistência do 4-3-3 o Barcelona que joga dessa maneira, mas não esquecer que tanto o Messi como o Henry procuram muitas vezes zonas centrais e que tanto Xavi como Iniesta jogam praticamente de olhos fechados.


Dei o exemplo especifico do meu clube para mostrar as razões para que falam muito da importância de um quarto médio principalmente nesse tipo de jogos porque o 4-3-3 a nivel nacional é mais do que suficiente devido ao nosso futebol previsivel e lento.
E fiz este testamento porque em "termos tácticos" ainda não havia nenhum post e se não concordaram digam e expliquem o porquê de gostarem mais de uma táctica especifica em relação ao 4-4-2 para haver também boas "discuções" tácticas. Smile
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15-05-2009, 23:39 (Esta mensagem foi modificada pela última vez a: 15-05-2009 23:41 por Scp_PT_100.)
Mensagem: #2
RE: [Táctica] o 4-4-2 e a "dimensão europeia"
Relativamente ao barça é diferente, porque o Inieste e um todo o terreno do tamanho, e tem cultura tactica suficiente, para saber o timming certo para ter de actuar como Extremo mais interior, de forma a tabelar com um dos da frente, entrando na área. É ai que reside um dos pontos que mais se nota no jogo do barça. E depois ter um jogador como Xavi a canalizar jogo, através das recuperações do Yaya, e muito bom. Muitas vezes no processo ofensivo o barça chega a atacar com 5 jogadores.

Quanto ao Porto, penso que nao tenha sido o Cristian Rodriguez descer para ala que melhorou as exibições do Porto, mas sim tornar o seu jogo mais Horizontal, fazendo as suas diagonais como referiste, mas logo de seguida flectindo para a ala, arrastando consigo 1 ou 2 defesas, dando espaço ao Lucho para entrar e destabilizando a marcações fazendo com que o Lisandro tenha mais facilidade na desmarcação. E como disseste tambem, a entrada do Cisokho foi importantissima, porque fez com que o Porto conseguisse ter um defesa-ala-extremo esquerdo, dando mais margem de manobra ao Raul Meireles que tinha de fechar mais a esquerda, podendo agora fixar-se mais ao centro e tabelar co Lucho ou rematar, visto que se repararem, ele começou a rematar mais desde que o Cissoko entrou no esquema do Porto. Voltando ao Rodriguez, as suas descaidas para dentro, fazem muitas vezes com que o porto jogue, e apesar de ser estranho, num 4-2-2-2, com 2 medios: Fernando em movimentos horizontais, e o Raul meireles em quadrado, 2 medios ofensivos, sendo que o Lucho funciona como nº6, e o Rodriguez como falso 10, libertando o Hulk nas alas, devido a sua tecnica, faz com que seja capaz de arranjar espaço para cruzar, e Lisandro na area para finalizar. E depois ter um defesa Central como o Bruno Alves, que tem um jogo aéreo muito bom, faz com que o Porto recupere muitas bolas, vindas de livres ou pontapés de baliza adversarios, no seu meio campo defensivo.
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16-05-2009, 00:03
Mensagem: #3
RE: [Táctica] o 4-4-2 e a "dimensão europeia"
Sim é completamente diferente o Barça daí ter referido uma equipa europeia com processos semelhantes ao 4-3-3 que não perdia a lucidez do seu esquema devido a cultura táctica principalmente dos seus médios. Claro que o Iniesta devido as suas caracteristicas permite subir de forma a ser um extremo mais interior como referiste mas de reparara que ele só faz isso bem na esquerda porque as vezes que tentou articular esse jogo na direita correu mal porque ele tem tendência a flectir para o meio tendo que utilizar mais vezes o pé esquerdo que não o usa tão bem como o direito. Aí está uma diferença quando o Barça joga com o Yaya ou o Keita na posição de trinco porque o Keita é um jogador mais ofensivo e tem muita tendência a levar o jogo pela direita porque chegou a jogar muitas vezes na carreira como médio interior direito enquanto o Touré é um jogar muito mais pendular.

Mas em muitas ocasiões do jogo o Porto jogar com mais um médio por momentos foi importante para estabilizar principalmente os processos defensivos. Mas também como referiste foi importante um jogador como o Raul que não tinha referido que fechou bastante as subidas do Cissokho quando o Rodriguez fazia movimentos mais interiores. Mas por mais que os processos da equipa mudem ao longo do jogo o mais importante é ter um jogador tácticamente como o Lucho que entende todos os processos a nivel de meio-campo e se for preciso fechando também na subida de algum lateral quando a equipa está mais desorganizada, daí canalizar muito bem tanto os processos defensivos como ofensivos funcionando como agora está muito na gíria o "8,5" devido à "inexistência" no futebol moderno de "números 10". Quanto ao tal 4-2-2-2 percebo o que queres dizer na segunda parte da primeira mão entre o Porto e o Manchester (que o Porto não atacou tanto como a primeira) mas funcionou bastante bem tendo os dois mais recuados Meireles e Fernando ficado no meio, e o Rodriguez e o Lucho faziam movimentos verticais prendendo os médios ala do Manchester.
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20-05-2009, 14:22
Mensagem: #4
RE: [Táctica] o 4-4-2 e a "dimensão europeia"
Eu não consigo fazer esses tópico tão grandes mas vou tentar...

4-4-2 é aquela táctica que usam mais, acho eu, pois da bem para jogar bem na ala e na finalização.

Não consegui --'
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12-02-2012, 05:04 (Esta mensagem foi modificada pela última vez a: 12-02-2012 05:09 por Monoglymn.)
Mensagem: #5
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